Hugh-Candoit (ENG) Posted January 11, 2008 Report Share Posted January 11, 2008 Dont let his head swell too much or it will have him overbalancing when he does his side kicks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kobblers Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 word association game? huh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironplanet uk900 Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 word association game? huh? Tek no notice Rick, They're talking about the fools area Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kobblers Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KJ SOLUTIONS Posted January 16, 2008 Report Share Posted January 16, 2008 i too was also taught to nail the waist when i first started with minit. then about 15yr ago they told use to stop nailing the waist all thats required is a good graf When i look back on this i was taught good graf technique we just nail them as well . You never win the Shoe Repair competition with nail waist Kev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh-Candoit (ENG) Posted January 16, 2008 Report Share Posted January 16, 2008 You never win the Shoe Repair competition with nail waist Kev Oh yes you can but no-one does it, you can get marks for this that other dont get. This can take your total marks above your nearest competitor and give you the winners prize. The rest of the job would have to be outstanding as would the riveting if many people entered with rivets after reading this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironplanet uk900 Posted January 16, 2008 Report Share Posted January 16, 2008 You never win the Shoe Repair competition with nail waist Kev Oh yes you can but no-one does it, you can get marks for this that other dont get. This can take your total marks above your nearest competitor and give you the winners prize. The rest of the job would have to be outstanding as would the riveting if many people entered with rivets after reading this. In my opinion, if the competition came down to the last two repairs to decide the winner and one pair was riveted and the other not. you couldn't possibly give the prize to the riveted pair. (A) we have agreed (even Hughby) that the riveted shoes would have been damaged to some degree, shank, insole, playrib and even the welt stitches in some cases. ( The riveted pair should never have got that far in the competition anyway. The Idea of quality shoe repairing is to reserve the shoes, not damage them in any way. © who is judging the competition, are they old school who believe that you should rivet. I would love to be a judge in the competition. I would give a full report on the reasons why I chose 1st 2nd & 3rd. I haven't seen anything about the actual repairs, only who won. Maybe there was a report, that I haven't seen. I would also Like to see the competition run by this forum. And not JR, or any other organisation that only run it for there own ends. The materials you use should be up to the indevidual and should be part of the judging. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh-Candoit (ENG) Posted January 16, 2008 Report Share Posted January 16, 2008 There are many answers but to cover just a couple. You cant let them choose their own materials, that is why the competition is carried out the way it is so that everyone is on the same playing field. Can you imagine the outcry if someone had the 1st choice of the best material, this is what happened in the past and everyone was griping about unfair competition. The suppliers then got to issue the materials, the same to every entrant. Nailing on competition shoes for those who want to go down this route, is for decorative purposes and is known generally as Artistic Interpretation by some of those who are or have been regular at these events. for instance if you had a pattern of a pair of Skaters on an Ice Rink in Austria with Wooden Chalets in the background and one shoe was a mirror image of the other foot, then the judges would not be looking inside at the insoles to see if each rivet had come through to the Insole and formed a cleat. The idea of competition rivetting is that you do not see the pointy end of the rivet, they(the rivets) are for decoration or artistic interpretation. The Udges are all chosen for their own skills, each may have a particular skill different to another and so the team will have a collective knowledge greater than just one person. They also are chosen for their fairness and impartiality so that every has the same opportunity to be a winner. Some of the judges may be past winners, some may be specialists in a particular field such as finishes or grafting of waists, what can be ascertained is that you would not be able to pull the wool over their eyes. Above this level sits the Adjudicator who advises and checks that everthing runs above board and according to the rules set out for the competition. There are several on this forum who are capable of producing entries, but if they do and they do not get anywhere I would bet cash that the moaning, groaning and gnashing of teeth would start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironplanet uk900 Posted January 16, 2008 Report Share Posted January 16, 2008 There are many answers but to cover just a couple. You cant let them choose their own materials, that is why the competition is carried out the way it is so that everyone is on the same playing field. Can you imagine the outcry if someone had the 1st choice of the best material, this is what happened in the past and everyone was griping about unfair competition. The suppliers then got to issue the materials, the same to every entrant. Nailing on competition shoes for those who want to go down this route, is for decorative purposes and is known generally as Artistic Interpretation by some of those who are or have been regular at these events. for instance if you had a pattern of a pair of Skaters on an Ice Rink in Austria with Wooden Chalets in the background and one shoe was a mirror image of the other foot, then the judges would not be looking inside at the insoles to see if each rivet had come through to the Insole and formed a cleat. The idea of competition rivetting is that you do not see the pointy end of the rivet, they are for decoration or artistic interpretation. I'm sorry Hugh, I seem to be disagreeing with you all the time of late. But I thought it was a shoe repair competition.....not a pretty riveting competition. I have said many times, if the rivet doesn't come through the insole and flatten its self on your last, its pointless because they will ride out as soon as they are worn. Whats the point of anyone entering who doesn't believe in riveting, if the judges are looking for "Decoration and artistic riveting" as you say...There is so much more to look for in a quality repair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elfman Posted January 16, 2008 Report Share Posted January 16, 2008 well said hugh it must be run by a supplier tor insure that all materials are of the same speck if i tried using the top quality leathers and charged the amount that is being quoted as the average price i would not get the workeven when you explain to the customer that the better matterials wear better and longer the will still not want to pay the extra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh-Candoit (ENG) Posted January 16, 2008 Report Share Posted January 16, 2008 I'm sorry Hugh, I seem to be disagreeing with you all the time of late. But I thought it was a shoe repair competition.....not a pretty riveting competition. That's because you are wrong It's about amassing points UK and as we all know, points make prizes Let me give you an instance on the practicalities of the competition repair, If you repaired a pair of shoes for a customer I am 100% certain that that pair of shoes would stand up to an enormous amount of battering if being tested in my hand by bending at the waist ect, the edge finish would stay put, the waist would remain intact and the shoes could be worn without fear of anything going wrong. I would trust you full stop. A competition entry is a very different kettle of fish and this is where most people go wrong, it's window dressing at its best, to show to the world that even cobblers with bust thumbs can produce something of outstanding craftsmanship. The results are printed in many Newspapers Magazines and even on local TV, these shoes do not get worn do not get put under the testing by customers, they are a showpiece. If you went down the extreme technical poad then the shoes would have to be partially dismantled to ensure perfection was not corruption by stealth. Very difficult to get a Top Technician to migrate to the Artworld for a few months then revert back to being a technician but that's what it is like, you have to think on a different plane. Everyone who does not enter competitions or loses in competitions has a gripe about how they should be run, what should be the requirements and how they should be judged. There has to be a unform method of judging within structure of the competition, you cant allow every different idea to be implemented but if a good one comes to light I'm sure it would be implemented....if those who run the competitions found out about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironplanet uk900 Posted January 16, 2008 Report Share Posted January 16, 2008 well said hugh it must be run by a supplier to insure that all materials are of the same speck Why, everyone knows its a competition and should be doing a top quality job, So they should be using top quality materials like JR, Wares Exec etc if i tried using the top quality leathers and charged the amount that is being quoted as the average price i would not get the work even when you explain to the customer that the better materials wear better and longer they will still not want to pay the extra Thats a different argument, the competition isn't about whether YOUR customer would pay up or not, Its about an award winning shoe repair. Which I believe this forum has all the qualities to judge, and report why they judged the winners as winners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh-Candoit (ENG) Posted January 16, 2008 Report Share Posted January 16, 2008 THe forum has the criteria but not the set of rules, someone has to write the rules and mark out the pitch so that the goalposts do not get moved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironplanet uk900 Posted January 16, 2008 Report Share Posted January 16, 2008 THe forum has the criteria but not the set of rules, . You have to decide whether your up for it before youu apply the rules. Which wouldn't be difficult. someone has to write the rules and mark out the pitch so that the goalposts do not get moved. There are some members on here more than capable, not to mention our Adminitrator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh-Candoit (ENG) Posted January 16, 2008 Report Share Posted January 16, 2008 Go for it then. Put your name up in the Cutting Edge telling them of your proposals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironplanet uk900 Posted January 17, 2008 Report Share Posted January 17, 2008 Go for it then.Put your name up in the Cutting Edge telling them of your proposals. Just a thought here Hugh, We don't need permission off Cutting edge or anyone else. We are an independant body, and if we feel we want to run a national competition, then we can. We don't need to ask the big boys, cus we are big boys, all 600 of us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keithm Posted January 17, 2008 Report Share Posted January 17, 2008 Just a word of caution here UK900. You may find that the competition would hold more credibility if ALL of the Trade were involved Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironplanet uk900 Posted January 17, 2008 Report Share Posted January 17, 2008 Just a word of caution here UK900. You may find that the competition would hold more credibility if ALL of the Trade were involved Absolutely, You'd be more than welcome to sponsor us I'm not saying ditch all other parties, I'm saying this forum has enough credability to be able to launch our own competition. Why not......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keithm Posted January 17, 2008 Report Share Posted January 17, 2008 I look forward to seeing your plans Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironplanet uk900 Posted January 17, 2008 Report Share Posted January 17, 2008 I look forward to seeing your plans Remember this Keith, this forum has given your company a higher profile at a very low cost. And has more than paid for your advert/sponsorship. I for one brought a machine from you, which I wouldn't have if it wasn't for this forum.........how many more have done the same. So raising the forums profile would be in your interests as well as the forums. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keithm Posted January 17, 2008 Report Share Posted January 17, 2008 Exactly, What a great decision of mine that was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironplanet uk900 Posted January 17, 2008 Report Share Posted January 17, 2008 We'll pencil you in for sponsorship then Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee Posted January 17, 2008 Report Share Posted January 17, 2008 Exactly, What a great decision of mine that was. With out blowing Keiths trumpet tooooooooooooooo much, from the suppliers point of view he did see the potential of the site from day one! since I had not mentioned it to anyone, until the point my letter arrived at the cuttingedge magazine it was good to see him become the first member. And Standards subsequent financial support to cover the escalating costs at that time. Reading UKs previous post & Keiths response, its nice to know value for money has been acheived. Lee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironplanet uk900 Posted January 17, 2008 Report Share Posted January 17, 2008 And Keith also supports the forum with his constant posting, and valuable opinions. Even though he's always wrong :lol:just kidding Keith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keithm Posted January 18, 2008 Report Share Posted January 18, 2008 I thank yow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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