HarryHeffernan Posted August 26, 2017 Report Share Posted August 26, 2017 As I'm trying to improve daily on my repairs I'm curious to how people do the "graft" on half leathers? I looked at the how to pictures Lee put up and found it very helpful and I also came across the shoes he done for a competition and they looked flawless! Are people's everyday repairs to this standard? I've tried experimenting and cutting the waist line with a knife and skiving it then doing the rest on the machine. Any help will be much appreciated 😠Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kobblers Posted August 27, 2017 Report Share Posted August 27, 2017 You need to make sure that the 'graft' is as thin and long as you can get it, at the point where it meets the waist - My grafts were about two inches long as short grafts tend not to be as flexible and are susceptible to 'popping' when the foot bends. We don't do half leather soles anymore but when we did I used to scour mine thin on 24 grit. I reckon the angle was less than 2 degrees. I had to do it in stages as, sometimes, the leather would get too hot and caramelise. I also used something solid behind where I was grafting to support the leather as it got thinner. When it comes to the actual waist, I never, ever, cut into the leather with the scouring band as you risk causing a split.I basically just scoured it enough to open the fibres for the adhesive to stick correctly. You have to ensure that the angle at the waist complements the angle on the graft so that the leather is the same thickness all round the edge of the sole when finished. I also use tek10 primer as a leather sealer on the shoe and the new sole before I applied the adhesive. (The same way a carpenter uses sanding sealer). We don't do half leather soles anymore for the reason that you can see in the picture below. The waist on the shoe was pitted and rough as hell when we attached the half sole and even though I thoroughly sanded it with wet and dry and filled it as best as I could, it still didn't look good enough for what I would deem an acceptable repair for the money. We now take the sole all the way down to the breast of the shoe, (we scribe it with a pencil and a standard metal washer to match the curve at the breast), and as you can see in the second picture, the result is flawless. Hope this helps. Rick. chrisorros and HarryHeffernan 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarryHeffernan Posted August 27, 2017 Author Report Share Posted August 27, 2017 Thanks a lot Rick for taking the time to reply to this. That was very helpful. Great work on them repairs I would have been over the moon with both of them! I've found that I've had the problem with the leather going a bit caramelised before so what you explained has opened my eyes a lot to different ways of preparing the shoe and sole 👠kobblers 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Count Muppet Posted August 27, 2017 Report Share Posted August 27, 2017 If you want good results Harry, then you need to ask buying department for bands direct from standard and also ask for a better quality leather than the crap from warehouse. The leather is caremelising because it's either low quality or because the bands are awful. kobblers 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarryHeffernan Posted August 27, 2017 Author Report Share Posted August 27, 2017 Yeah the quality of the leather isn't great but I'm using what's meant to be their better quality and I change my bands regularly and have one set up that I only use for leather work. I didn't know you could go through buying department for better bands? I'll request this on Tuesday 😀 kobblers 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Count Muppet Posted August 27, 2017 Report Share Posted August 27, 2017 As long as you take the money and can justify why you want the higher price product then you can order what you like. kobblers 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kobblers Posted August 27, 2017 Report Share Posted August 27, 2017 Thanks a lot Rick for taking the time to reply to this. That was very helpful. Great work on them repairs I would have been over the moon with both of them! I've found that I've had the problem with the leather going a bit caramelised before so what you explained has opened my eyes a lot to different ways of preparing the shoe and sole No probs, mate - that's what the forum is intended for Count's right: get better bands. It's not always low quality leather that caramelises - the top end stuff will, too, if you scour too quick or hard. I gauge the quality of leather like I would have gauged a piece of wood when I was a carpenter: lots of fibrous bits and loose grain = crap; no fibres and really tight grain = good stuff. Rick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flash Posted August 27, 2017 Report Share Posted August 27, 2017 You need to make sure that the 'graft' is as thin and long as you can get it, at the point where it meets the waist - My grafts were about two inches long as short grafts tend not to be as flexible and are susceptible to 'popping' when the foot bends. We don't do half leather soles anymore but when we did I used to scour mine thin on 24 grit. I reckon the angle was less than 2 degrees. I had to do it in stages as, sometimes, the leather would get too hot and caramelise. I also used something solid behind where I was grafting to support the leather as it got thinner. When it comes to the actual waist, I never, ever, cut into the leather with the scouring band as you risk causing a split.I basically just scoured it enough to open the fibres for the adhesive to stick correctly. You have to ensure that the angle at the waist complements the angle on the graft so that the leather is the same thickness all round the edge of the sole when finished. I also use tek10 primer as a leather sealer on the shoe and the new sole before I applied the adhesive. (The same way a carpenter uses sanding sealer). We don't do half leather soles anymore for the reason that you can see in the picture below. The waist on the shoe was pitted and rough as hell when we attached the half sole and even though I thoroughly sanded it with wet and dry and filled it as best as I could, it still didn't look good enough for what I would deem an acceptable repair for the money. We now take the sole all the way down to the breast of the shoe, (we scribe it with a pencil and a standard metal washer to match the curve at the breast), and as you can see in the second picture, the result is flawless. Hope this helps. Rick.shoe.jpgshoe full.jpg sole.png "The result is flawless" I have never achieved that in my life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kobblers Posted August 28, 2017 Report Share Posted August 28, 2017 The result is flawless compared to the original method. Satisfied? Rick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keithm Posted August 29, 2017 Report Share Posted August 29, 2017 We don't do half leather soles anymore but when we did I used to scour mine thin on 24 grit. I reckon the angle was less than 2 degrees. I had to do it in stages as, sometimes, the leather would get too hot and caramelise. I also used something solid behind where I was grafting to support the leather as it got thinner. Hope this helps. Rick.shoe.jpgshoe full.jpg sole.png When leather burns and caramalises, it's normally because the band is 'blunt', always use sharp bands when scouring leather. If you have speed control on your finisher use the lower setting, it helps kobblers 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kobblers Posted August 29, 2017 Report Share Posted August 29, 2017 Good advice, Keith. Cheers. Rick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flash Posted August 29, 2017 Report Share Posted August 29, 2017 The result is flawless compared to the original method. Satisfied? Rick. O.K.!!! How do you thin the waist for the first few inches? do you have a splitter? or is it a manual job? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kobblers Posted August 30, 2017 Report Share Posted August 30, 2017 Trade secret Manual, using a bloody sharp knife. Rick. HarryHeffernan 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keithm Posted August 30, 2017 Report Share Posted August 30, 2017 O.K.!!! How do you thin the waist for the first few inches? do you have a splitter? or is it a manual job? I assume you are talking about the material going on the shoe? If so, scour it Nice sharp band mind! If it colours brown it won't stick well kobblers 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flash Posted August 30, 2017 Report Share Posted August 30, 2017 I assume you are talking about the material going on the shoe? If so, scour it Nice sharp band mind! If it colours brown it won't stick well Rather use a splitter, much easier, quicker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarryHeffernan Posted August 30, 2017 Author Report Share Posted August 30, 2017 Might be a really dumb question but what's a splitter? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Count Muppet Posted August 30, 2017 Report Share Posted August 30, 2017 Might be a really dumb question but what's a splitter? You ain't getting one of those 😂 😂 kobblers 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flash Posted August 30, 2017 Report Share Posted August 30, 2017 Might be a really dumb question but what's a splitter? Similar to a skiver but wider rollers and blade, HarryHeffernan 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kobblers Posted August 31, 2017 Report Share Posted August 31, 2017 There ya go, Harry. A splitter: https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Leather+splitter&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjXsuLhl4HWAhXMCMAKHUH-CG8Q_AUIDCgD&biw=1920&bih=960#imgrc=VQW45HhV245POM: Rick. HarryHeffernan 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keithm Posted August 31, 2017 Report Share Posted August 31, 2017 Rather use a splitter, much easier, quicker. If you have one Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grahamparker Posted August 31, 2017 Report Share Posted August 31, 2017 Or your a member of the Popular front of Judea. "SPLITTER" kobblers 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keithm Posted August 31, 2017 Report Share Posted August 31, 2017 Fuck off!!!! grahamparker and kobblers 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kobblers Posted August 31, 2017 Report Share Posted August 31, 2017 Ooh, such profanity.............. Rick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kobblers Posted August 31, 2017 Report Share Posted August 31, 2017 BTW, I concur, Keith Rick. keithm 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gray Posted August 31, 2017 Report Share Posted August 31, 2017 Or your a member of the Popular front of Judea. "SPLITTER" Popular front of Judea........ ...................Peoples front of Judea............. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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