Alphamax Posted July 10, 2016 Report Share Posted July 10, 2016 Hi as I'm new to this industry I'm trying to understand how these chips are prepared , I recently programmed a new Citroen Xsara Picasso ( that's what it was advertised as) remote key but remote would not sync with car at all , I also tried to programme a Berlingo key which was new also but it did not programme the transponder , whenever I read the chip it is coming up as locked , I have another key the same which is new which also comes up locked , my understanding is that if these are locked they can't be programmed ? Whenever I read some of the other Citreon chips they come up as ' password - Manchester ' mode . Thanks in advance . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neal Southern Posted July 10, 2016 Report Share Posted July 10, 2016 If the transponder reads as locked it has been programmed to a car, either the one you were working on or another one. Are you sure it's new ? Where did you get it ? You can toss that in the bin or keep for parts only. PSW - Manchester is ready to programme to the car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphamax Posted July 10, 2016 Author Report Share Posted July 10, 2016 It's an aftermarket one Neal but what I don't understand is , that all my Renault Laguna , Megane Keycards read as locked but programme to the vehicle without a problem ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neal Southern Posted July 10, 2016 Report Share Posted July 10, 2016 What are you reading them with ? If it's Peugeot/Citroen and they read as locked they can't be used. I am not sure whats up with Renault at the moment but the same should apply. I say it should be the same because the other day I got some 3 button remotes from 3D which I read before I programmed it and they were all locked. They have said although they read as locked it should code in. So I tried and much to my surprise it coded in. Strange ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-Power Posted July 11, 2016 Report Share Posted July 11, 2016 Blank ID46 transponders can work in two ways: 1. Password mode 2. Cypher mode most of transponder devices recognyzes ID46 blank transponders as unlocked only when they are set in password mode and it's memory contains default Philips/NXP data. Blank ID46 transponders for Renault are set in Cypher mode, is for that they are recognyzed (incorrectly) as locked. In some other applications where is needed transponders with precoding it happens the same: the memory transponder is not set as default, transponder devices are not able to do authentication and the transponder is recognyzed as locked Kris Polan 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphamax Posted July 11, 2016 Author Report Share Posted July 11, 2016 Neal they are read on a IEA Zed bull , I presume by cypher mode that also means locked mode , it was the first key I have done that wouldn't programme to the car , however it's not the first car ( Citreon ) that I couldn't get the locking to work ( Xsara Picasso & c3 ) for some reason , I was under the impression that Citreon and Peugeot were the same ? The Peugeot I have had no bother with . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rapidlocks Posted July 11, 2016 Report Share Posted July 11, 2016 if using after market , ie china keys then you will encounter problems sometimes , also some bought on ebay may be refurbished and have non paired chip and board inside or used parts inside . despite what coverage ebay sellers may claim , 1 remote doesnt do all years , new or not , you must have correct remote part for vehicle year for the cost of oem parts , its not worth buying aftermarket on these . also what year of berlingo did you fail to program transponder chip to ie very early models used id33 chip , i take it pin code was correct and accepted ? berlingo remote models 2000 to 2003 used remote part number 6490L8 2002 to 2008 used remote part number 6554RH 2009 plus models used flip key part number 6490EO so when you hit cross over years say late 2002 to late 2003 it could be either or , so check vin with good supplier for correct part or on citroen site if you have access . also worth noting that not all berlingo models have remote central locking fitted/activated same with xsara picasso and c3 , different remote parts for different years , and same issues on cross over years. what year were your failures ? what programmer was you using ? its difficult to offer advice on the probable cause of the failures without info such as . make , model , year of failure , part number being used etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphamax Posted July 11, 2016 Author Report Share Posted July 11, 2016 So far , failures have been , 2005 Citroen C3 ( programmed transponder but remote wouldn't work ) 2006 Xsara Picasso , same as above and a 2005 Citroen Berlingo , transponder not programmable , I tried Lexia 3 and mvp pro , same result. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ponsaloti Posted July 11, 2016 Report Share Posted July 11, 2016 Is your kit or keys oriental ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphamax Posted July 11, 2016 Author Report Share Posted July 11, 2016 Keys , but I have no problems with them only on these vehicles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ponsaloti Posted July 11, 2016 Report Share Posted July 11, 2016 What other vehicles do you programme these keys too ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rapidlocks Posted July 11, 2016 Report Share Posted July 11, 2016 the problem will be your keys with so many failures , 1 remote for each model does not do all , if you have the wrong remote part then it wont code the remote in , if your seller sells just 1 remote for say C3 pre canbus it wont work on both different remote systems , so my guess is that its for the other system and not the one you need . the 2005 C3 if not a late 55 plate would be 1 of 2 possible remotes either part number 6554RE if not pluriel model as this remote only does pluriel models up to 2003, or part 6554RJ if a pluriel model after 2003 . if a late 55 plate could be first of the canbus models though unlikely still a possible. in either case the chip will program fine , but if the wrong remote you wont synch it in a month of sundays . cross over years can complicate things further. the 2006 xsara picasso will use part number 6554RH and not the earlier part number 6490L8 , again if not using the correct part the chip will code in but not the remote . in both the above id say your issue is definitely the keys you are buying , either the wrong part for the vehicle you are working on , or keys were the board and chip are not properly paired up . with the 2005 berlingo it should be part number 6554RH and not the earlier 6490L8 , though the chips from both would code in , so in this one i suspect a transponder issue , either wrong transponder precoding or a used transponder . just because you have success with keys for renault and peugeot from this source doesnt mean all keys are good , you are not having success on citroen , and as numerous issues this suggests an issue with these keys on citroen , try buying the correct part number oem remote and i bet they code in without issue if using genuine mvp pro or lexia . copy keys may be cheap but they do have issues , my guess is they are for a different part number to what you need, this is a case where buying genuine will indeed save you money in long run on citroen as just burning keys on these if determined to use copy keys , then you need to know for what part number they are a copy of , then what part number you need for the model you are working on , you can then check that they are compatible, this is of course assuming they are not used and are a properly matched chip and board pair, better still use just oem parts on these , if bought from a good supplier and you send them vin number they will confirm correct part for you , or get a log in to citroen site which you can then check correct part yourself from vin, this way you overcome the cross over year lottery too and never burn keys wastefully. Kris Polan and completelocks 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simes Posted July 12, 2016 Report Share Posted July 12, 2016 What are you reading them with ? If it's Peugeot/Citroen and they read as locked they can't be used. I am not sure whats up with Renault at the moment but the same should apply. I say it should be the same because the other day I got some 3 button remotes from 3D which I read before I programmed it and they were all locked. They have said although they read as locked it should code in. So I tried and much to my surprise it coded in. Strange ! Not an expert but if you ordered the key cards by VIN, then I believe they have some pre-coding on them and will only work on the vehicle ordered for? That may be the reason...I think? completelocks 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neal Southern Posted July 12, 2016 Report Share Posted July 12, 2016 They aren't ordered to vin. Came from 3D locked. It's the 3 button Renault Master remotes. The 2 button Renault Master remotes aren't locked. They both programmed in as I used them last week. So whether it's in cypher mode or not why does the one read as locked and the other not ? To confuse the issue I ordered a Dacia Sandero remote from 3D and it came locked. I sent it back to 3D and they sent it back to me again saying they all read as locked. I couldn't programme it and the car then went to 2 different Dacia dealers and they said transponder in key was faulty. I assume it's because it's locked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphamax Posted July 12, 2016 Author Report Share Posted July 12, 2016 If you order them from Renault dealer they come pre-coded , this was the case for vehicles after June 2006 , their diagnostic device ( can clip ) will not programme the key otherwise . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
completelocks Posted July 12, 2016 Report Share Posted July 12, 2016 Too many coincidences here. Do you use the 3D part look up? enter reg and it tells you which part to order. Could be an update of the programmer needed.. Just an ide, but it does sound like wrong remotes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rapidlocks Posted July 12, 2016 Report Share Posted July 12, 2016 if using copy keys for citroen , do you know what part number they are a copy of ? if not then you will burn keys trying to find out if unlucky .is your mvp a genuine mvp pro ? is your lexia a genuine lexia or chinese counterfiet clone ? the best advice for you is to check for correct part and use genuine part and im sure these issues will be behind you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphamax Posted July 12, 2016 Author Report Share Posted July 12, 2016 No , both genuine , it's definitely the remotes imo also after reading all the comments , it's just the earlier keys , the flip key remotes are always 100% although I do have a part no to work from on them . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphamax Posted July 14, 2016 Author Report Share Posted July 14, 2016 Just an update , done a C4 today , key read as locked transponder but programmed to the car no problem . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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