jimmerjammer Posted August 12, 2011 Report Share Posted August 12, 2011 Hi all We currently have no engraving facility at present but i am starting to get asked a lot more often, mostly pet tags and trinkets. We have bought one of these Record Power hand engravers but my handwriting is so bad, its just not going to do So onto topic, what do you know about manual pantographs? I am seeing them sell for between 4 and 600 and this would be a reasonable entry level price for us at the moment while we guage interest and build up some more capital. I dont want to be spending thousands at this point. Are they a commercially viable option? Would it just be a waste of money? Any help / advise would be appreciated Regards JJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee Posted August 12, 2011 Report Share Posted August 12, 2011 I used a pantograph for years & at the time they where more than viable, that was until the computer arrived! now customers are so computer literate that they know what font they want, what size they want it & are well educated in what a computer can do. This means that whilst a pantograph will do some things, most will appear second rate to a customer if they are used to engraving. Take pet tags as an example. in the old days I used a block lettering, with an outlined block for the animals name & they (at the time) looked OK Now I use a lettering thats 3-4 times as wide as a one pass on the pantograph for the details & a nice infilled 3d effect for the animals name. You'd be better off investing a £1000 on a flat bed computer engraver than 4-600 on a pantograph (IMO) Lee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevenB Posted August 12, 2011 Report Share Posted August 12, 2011 I'm with Lee on this one, the time for pantograph's is past. We borrowed (a reasonable sum!) to buy our first computer engraver & it paid for itself within a year. You can do so much more on a computer machine (think multiple fonts, infinite font size adjustments, text on an arc or any other orientation, reversed engraving (for reading from the other side of a sign), engraving irregularly shaped items, pens, shapes & logos, I could go on...) that only a fool would buy a panto to get into the engraving trade. (IMO) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmerjammer Posted August 12, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 12, 2011 Cheers Lee Sound advice as always Will try and get pantographs out of my head and start looking into flat bed's Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmerjammer Posted August 12, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 12, 2011 Again, thanks StevenB I am glad i asked the question as i was seriously looking into them. Cheers guys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee Posted August 12, 2011 Report Share Posted August 12, 2011 when I got my flat bed is200 I had a pantograph running along side it for a few years until I could afford the tx version, they day I got the tx the panto went under the bench. I had planned to use it if I ever got problems with the computer engrave. however I sold it the very next week simply because I now know if & when the computer once has trouble I'll borrow the money to replace it rather than go back to a pantograph! The reason Pantographs still fetch money is because hobbyists or under informed people buy them & they are available! you have to keep your eyes peeled for a computer engraver. Good Luck! Once purchased you can get any software help from those in the chat room, there's both vistool & gravo users in there pretty much all the time, who can sort you out quickly. Lee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Count Muppet Posted August 12, 2011 Report Share Posted August 12, 2011 Lol, Timpson are still stupid enough to put these into every new shop they open, which i would guess loses them a fortune in work being turned away. Absolute waste of money these days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hibsjo(SCO) Posted August 12, 2011 Report Share Posted August 12, 2011 if all your doing is trophies then its fine giftware, unless you got a load of fonts, no use my mate has his own trophy shop and hes only got pantograph, engraves all day long and some times all night long carry on! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee Posted August 12, 2011 Report Share Posted August 12, 2011 & there's another point! they aren't very commercially viable anymore, simply because they take you all day & all night to achieve what a computer engraver can do in a few hours. These days time is money & throwing the money at the WRONG engravers going to cost you dear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevenB Posted August 13, 2011 Report Share Posted August 13, 2011 they take you all day & all night to achieve what a computer engraver can do in a few hours. you mean in a few minutes. \:D/ Give the various companies a call (U-Marq, Gravograph etc) there's every chance they may have a second hand machine they want to move on & you could pick up a bargain. It worked for me when I wanted one last year & I got a bargain Gem from U-Marq \:D/ \:D/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmerjammer Posted August 13, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 13, 2011 Thanks all Coincidentally, i have just been looking at the U-Marq Gem-FX5 Flatbed May well give them a call and see what they have knocking about Cheers for the advise JJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petercoulson Posted August 13, 2011 Report Share Posted August 13, 2011 Can you wait until the end of September? The National Cutting Edge show is at Kettering on 25th and all the important companies will be there and may have some very good offers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmerjammer Posted August 13, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 13, 2011 Oh yeah, no urgency on this as such, want to make sure that we have explored all avenues before parting with such large amounts of money Kirkybob and I will be at the exhibition so will ensure that we keep our eyes peeled for a good deal ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
windycity Posted August 14, 2011 Report Share Posted August 14, 2011 guys don't write the panto off yet. it depends on the work you get coming through your door or what you go out and get. i tend to also do lots of yearly entries on very old silver cups that have been around since the 50's or older. also lots of schools/clubs want the same size fonts as from before. cups can be squished, bent and worse when old and this is when the panto saves the day. the perfect setup would be a top of the range computer and a pantograph for the above type jobs. using a pantogarph will also give you an understanding what engraving is all about then you go to the next level and invest in a computer based one. get a umarq machine though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee Posted August 14, 2011 Report Share Posted August 14, 2011 cups can be squished, bent and worse when oldif they can be held in your old pantograph, then they can be held in your modern equivalent. I wrote my pantograph off 24 hours after getting the is200tx. Lee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevenB Posted August 14, 2011 Report Share Posted August 14, 2011 I think it's probably a case of whichever method you're happier using on these annual updates - I have 3 computer engraving machines in the shop, but still use the old panto from time to time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee Posted August 14, 2011 Report Share Posted August 14, 2011 your kidding me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevenB Posted August 15, 2011 Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 I knew you'd like that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig Gardner Posted August 15, 2011 Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 forget the manual one get a computerised machine then invest in a laser one they are great we laser more than we engrave on the computerised machines now dumped my panto years ago and never missed it. craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmerjammer Posted August 15, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 Well what a difference a day makes (ok, maybe 2 days) We have gone from looking at £500 panto machines to make tentative enquiries with Davenports about 2 U-Marq machines, blimey Consider me convinced! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keithm Posted August 15, 2011 Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 Well what a difference a day makes (ok, maybe 2 days) We have gone from looking at £500 panto machines to make tentative enquiries with Davenports about 2 U-Marq machines, blimey Consider me convinced! Way to go Jimmer!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevenB Posted August 15, 2011 Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 =D> =D> =D> You won't regret it - particularly once you receive your first copy of the Vistool (the name of U-Marq's engraving software) Owners Club magazine "Vistooling Around" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Posted August 15, 2011 Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 Sorted my upgrade from Vistool6 to Vistool8 today, should be up and running within the next couple of days I'm now a more modern tool.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gray Posted August 15, 2011 Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 Sorted my upgrade from Vistool6 to Vistool8 today, should be up and running within the next couple of days I'm now a more modern tool.... =D> =D> =D> About bloody time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Posted August 15, 2011 Report Share Posted August 15, 2011 Big thanks to Vanessa @ Umarq who was trying to get updated drivers from Denmark for my controller. =D> =D> =D> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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