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^The leave vote won't be split if the referendum is done right. It'll just be clarified. 

26 minutes ago, Flash said:

Because the choice is not up to the public at large, once the powers that be have the result they want we will remain in E.U.

ah yes, Jacob-Rees Mogg and Boris Johnston, men of the people 

Brexit has been stalled thus far because, a year after the referendum, we had a general election. A democratic process which took seats away from the main leave party and handed seats to the remainy parties. If the will of the people wasn't a fluid thing, that wouldn't have happened and we'd be long gone from the EU by now. But the public at large decided against that. 

 

The only chance for a 'no-deal-brexit' is a second referendum, because there will be no significant parties campaigning for such an outcome if we do have a general election. By far the most likely outcome of a general election is 'brexit-with-a-deal'; all that is up for grabs is the specifics of the deal and how much more fannying about back and forth until it is implemented. 

30 minutes ago, petercoulson said:

 If stay is and wins then why shouldn't we have a 3rd referendum?4th?5th? 

bit of a strawman -  now we would be voting with greater knowledge of and control over the possible outcomes. the mere fact that brexit means different things to different people shows the flaw at the heart of the matter. 

Edited by GLENGRAVING
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33 minutes ago, Flash said:

So referendum = stay.

 

Bit defeatist. 


Could be that your case is strengthened (with many fence-sitters and even remainers now just wanting to 'get brexit done') - that's what Farage reckons. It should at least offer a distinction between the two popular forms of Brexit, without splitting the leave vote - this is not beyond the wit of man. 
https://www.electoral-reform.org.uk/what-does-preferential-voting-mean/

Edited by GLENGRAVING
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On 10/25/2019 at 8:08 PM, GLENGRAVING said:

^The leave vote won't be split if the referendum is done right. It'll just be clarified. 

ah yes, Jacob-Rees Mogg and Boris Johnston, men of the people 

Brexit has been stalled thus far because, a year after the referendum, we had a general election. A democratic process which took seats away from the main leave party and handed seats to the remainy parties. If the will of the people wasn't a fluid thing, that wouldn't have happened and we'd be long gone from the EU by now. But the public at large decided against that. 

 

The only chance for a 'no-deal-brexit' is a second referendum, because there will be no significant parties campaigning for such an outcome if we do have a general election. By far the most likely outcome of a general election is 'brexit-with-a-deal'; all that is up for grabs is the specifics of the deal and how much more fannying about back and forth until it is implemented. 

bit of a strawman -  now we would be voting with greater knowledge of and control over the possible outcomes. the mere fact that brexit means different things to different people shows the flaw at the heart of the matter. 

With all due respect: absolute bollocks - you're not taking into account the fact that most of Parliament is for Remain and they have done everything to to stymie the original result. The subsequent election is irrelevant because, it doesn't matter how fluid the original vote is, or isn't, we are being led down the garden path by people who we eelct, and are meant to represent us, a merry dance because they think they're better.

I've noticed that Remainers think a second, more-informed vote is now the way to go: why the hell should we respect the outcome of said vote if they can't honour the first vote.

"Now we're more informed"? - that's the siren call of all those moaning gits who are still sucking their thumbs because they're sore losers: democracy is based upon loser's consent and if you can't accept that maybe we might have been less-informed but willing to go with what we knew in our hearts was right then that says a whole load about Remainers.

Patronisation is a tool of the weak who don't have a good argument or educated retort.

Rick.

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idea of a new party that has a fresh batch of honest people who don't come from privileged background or simply are not career politicians is obviously appealing but , and its a big but people behind brexit party are hardly GETTING RID OF THEM ALL..

farage is from previliged background with extremely dodgy and hypocritical past

most of his front runners are extremely racist, immoral (just like boris/trump) 

anne widecombe is a career politician who hasnt made any real impact or change in 50 years of her career, suddenly she is a revolutionary..

sadly labour benches are full of career politicians too hence the scots feel no connection with westminster or south and look for GET RID OF THEM ALL in real sense

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28 minutes ago, hakeemz said:

idea of a new party that has a fresh batch of honest people who don't come from privileged background or simply are not career politicians is obviously appealing but , and its a big but people behind brexit party are hardly GETTING RID OF THEM ALL..

farage is from previliged background with extremely dodgy and hypocritical past

most of his front runners are extremely racist, immoral (just like boris/trump) 

anne widecombe is a career politician who hasnt made any real impact or change in 50 years of her career, suddenly she is a revolutionary..

sadly labour benches are full of career politicians too hence the scots feel no connection with westminster or south and look for GET RID OF THEM ALL in real sense

Sweeping bias statement presumably your against brexit and the will of the people. In that case I am against the next general election result if it goes against or agree with what i voted for.

And if we have another referendum and it goes against brexit I will demand another referendum. 

What goes around comes around  

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face it , the EU dont want us to leave and if we do they dont want it to be an attractive divorce as they must deter others from doing the same to survive , our own politicians dont want to give up their eu pay outs and pensions , so the negotiations were always stacked to remain . with no desire to leave from those in power one has to question whether it will actually happen at all .

its proven that a referendum again wont work unless it delivers the result the politicians want , if not we are back to the start , the eu way is to keep voting until the desired outcome is achieved.

one question i would really like an answer to is , how much has been spent on brexit so far , how much in pay and expenses has been paid already to mp's to get this stalemate ? 

a general election is the only way , but if it achieves a hung parliment as is likely , this may just drag on , at some point someone has to decide to just leave with no deal or revoke and stay and i would happily go with no deal to move on

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World Cup Rugby BREAKING NEWS

" I’m sorry to inform everyone on here who has supported the England rugby team in the World Cup, but New Zealand have requested another game to be played as the result was too close to call and they had players waiting to play who weren’t quite old enough. So now the World Cup needs to be put on hold for the foreseeable future until a new date can be arranged for a rematch. A minimum 90 day delay has been requested, but this could be a flextension that could last for years.

It has been suggested that shipments of New Zealand lamb could be affected by the result leading to serious lamb shortages on the shelves in the UK. This should make us think again about accepting this unfair result. No one knew this before the game concluded and it could have altered the result.

Furthermore, it has been suggested that the England team were offered large financial inducements, in the form of win bonuses, if they were to reach the final. There have been calls to have these fully investigated to establish the source of the inducements while the delay is in place.

In other news: some of the other teams have now objected to the terms of the final and have insisted that the final is delayed until NO WIN is taken off the table. These opponents of NO WIN have rejected calls that this should be put to a formal vote of any kind before their demands are ratified! ''

Popped up on one of my WhatsApps.

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49 minutes ago, cowers lane 583 said:

World Cup Rugby BREAKING NEWS

" I’m sorry to inform everyone on here who has supported the England rugby team in the World Cup, but New Zealand have requested another game to be played as the result was too close to call and they had players waiting to play who weren’t quite old enough. So now the World Cup needs to be put on hold for the foreseeable future until a new date can be arranged for a rematch. A minimum 90 day delay has been requested, but this could be a flextension that could last for years.

It has been suggested that shipments of New Zealand lamb could be affected by the result leading to serious lamb shortages on the shelves in the UK. This should make us think again about accepting this unfair result. No one knew this before the game concluded and it could have altered the result.

Furthermore, it has been suggested that the England team were offered large financial inducements, in the form of win bonuses, if they were to reach the final. There have been calls to have these fully investigated to establish the source of the inducements while the delay is in place.

In other news: some of the other teams have now objected to the terms of the final and have insisted that the final is delayed until NO WIN is taken off the table. These opponents of NO WIN have rejected calls that this should be put to a formal vote of any kind before their demands are ratified! ''

Popped up on one of my WhatsApps.

Time for a referendum to clarify this matter..........

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1 hour ago, jacko said:

The whole world is laughing at us.

But friends I have in some European countries are watching what happens very closely and say if it happens there will be more looking to do the same. We have talked a lot about Brexit here but my experience is they are talking about it event more in Europe where the general economy is suffering as well

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23 hours ago, kobblers said:

With all due respect: absolute bollocks

We can agree to disagree on the validity of certain parliamentarian's aims, but I really do think that a general election won't improve the situation - because of the likelihood of a hung parliament. If I actually thought Boris could get a sweeping majority, as much as I disagree with him, I'd look forward to the election because at least it would move us past this impasse. (But he won't, just look at the support for the Brexit party in this thread). 

There's no such thing as a single-issue general election, and a messy result won't give us a stronger brexit mandate. 

One thing I bet we can agree on is that the SNP/Lib Dems push to try extend the franchise to EU nationals in the UK is an overreach - even if it passed, it would completely invalidate the result in the eyes of any 'radical' brexiters. 

Edited by GLENGRAVING
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3 hours ago, Count Muppet said:

Easily solved to keep everyone happy

new referendum with 2 options

1. stay

2. leave

2a. Leave without deal

2b. Wait for deal.

 

if you pick leave you have to pick by which method.

surely that covers it?

kind of, yeah
single-transferable vote elections/referendums are a tested thing and would be suitable for our predicament 

http://theconversation.com/brexit-deadlock-this-three-way-referendum-design-could-break-it-108217 

*and we needn't wait for a deal, because we've had a deal comprehensively negotiated by our PM (twice). 

Edited by GLENGRAVING
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8 hours ago, Count Muppet said:

Easily solved to keep everyone happy

new referendum with 2 options

1. stay

2. leave

2a. Leave without deal

2b. Wait for deal.

 

if you pick leave you have to pick by which method.

surely that covers it?

Problem is if we put 2 then we are to all to STUPID to put another option because the remainers do not agree.

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